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W3C - "Peace only" - Countries suggested

Simcountry: Simcountry Bulletin Board  W3C - "Peace only" - Countries suggested

Spring Dice

Sunday, December 14, 2003 - 11:27 am Click here to edit this post
If the defense attacks the Strategic Bombers, each bomber that is shot down, will not be able to use its load. These are different steps in the attack process and the defense is first. In ALL cases. Any problem you may see, has to do with how the defense assesses the attacking force.

Again, I just wnated to send you the logs, but there is a problem here. I dont want you to think all the players are mistaken! :)

Elle and I had a theory about what was happening. We know that the defense fires first, but the interceptors shouod fire before the batteries do.

At first, we thought that:

If a player sends 1 attack helicopter and 26 strategic bombers, the missle interceptors will fire 4 missles - one for each missle launched by the attack helicopter. The interceptors might only respond in force to destroy that 1 atatck helicopter. The other swould get through.

Afterwards, "small numbers of strategic bombers" seemed to penetrate anyway, whther or not they were used in combination with anything else.

Making the defending airforce shoot first, then defnese missle interceptor batteries, then defending offensive air units, then offensive batteries deployed defensively, and finaly land units respond in that order should fix the error.

This is speculation. You should be able to find the cause and fix by looking throgh the logs. It is however an important error.

The forced redeployment of batteries is just as bad, and leads to conquer for other reasons.

Jozi

Tuesday, December 16, 2003 - 01:08 am Click here to edit this post
I think that I just read a possible explenation for the order waves and how they get in sync.
We need a way to record it during the process and we might be able to confirm it.

The bases not being on the list is true. I saw it last weekend too. I will have someone look into it this week. It happens with all new objects (bases, factories) that are placed on the map. They are added late in the month processing and not when they are delivered.

We tried to explain the attack process several times but without getting to the cumbersome details.

Attacks were made to behave like an exchange of fire in several stages.

The result is that attacks are broken to several pieces.

First, all the participating weapons from both sides are counted and the amount of ammunition is computed and checkd for availability.

Than, the defense starts with about one quarter of it power. It attacks the most dangerous weapons first. Then, the attacking force goes for about a quarter of its power and this repeats four times.

Each time, fewer weapons participate as some were destroyed in the previous stage. Sometime all the attack or defense weapons are destroyed half way the attack.

All the wepons destined for use that have no effect on the attacked target remain unused.

Missile interceptors are the first to shoot and they reduce the amount of ammunition that can be delivered to the target, than the short range missiles, etc.

This ordering of weapons results sometimes in damage to one type of weapon only.

If tanks and Cruise attack together, the cruis are more likely to be attacked by the defensive force. When they are gone, the tanks are attacked. (Depends on the defending weapons. Not all are effective against both).

The defense must be stong enough to get all the nukes in the very first stage. Both with anti missile missiles and the weapons themselves.

almoth

Tuesday, December 16, 2003 - 10:21 am Click here to edit this post
Thanks jozi for the explanation, just a quick question if thats ok.

If in the scenario you mentioned, say 1000 cruise and 1000 tanks ..and say 1000 artillery were used. And they were too much for the MIB to intercept. But the DH response was easily strong enough to destroy all the units in the first strike (lets say..500,000 DH sorty). Would the DH be able to attack all attacking unit types in the first strike?. Or would they just attack the most dangerous weapon in the first strike. Im pretty sure they would be able to hit multiple attacking types in the first strike, just trying to work out some of the "quirks"

The only other issue. I understand you dont want the defender to fire too much ammunition. However is it possible that in order to save ammunition the defender sometimes fires too few missiles and fails to kill the attackers in the first strike, even though it has the firepower to do so?

thanks, and sorry for the constant stream of dumb questions ;p

almoth

Tuesday, December 16, 2003 - 10:23 am Click here to edit this post
quote
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Making the defending airforce shoot first, then defnese missle interceptor batteries, then defending offensive air units, then offensive batteries deployed defensively, and finaly land units respond in that order should fix the error.

_____

i agree with this one, i think it would be better.

Jozi

Thursday, December 18, 2003 - 09:55 pm Click here to edit this post
I will start with the last suggestion.

The order of firing by the defense does not matter. They all fire before the attackers do. The priority of the targets they fire at, that is important.

They hit the most dangerous weapons first (nuclear) and the ground forces at the end.

Another small issue: MIB do not stop Tank fire. They stop missiles.

The problem I think is in the number of air force units - in the case we discuss it is DH - that are involved.

The procedure tries to prevent too much ammo being drawn but what is too much?

There are many parameters here (maybe too many).
We think that the procedure is ok and it is complex and changing the way it is computed may cause more trouble.

Another parameter is the portion of the airforce that was allowed to participate in the first place.

The argument there was that you cannot expect the whole airforce to go for the defense against one attack. In real battles, several attacks can take place simultanously.

The percentage was we think too low and we have increased it from 35 to 45%. Both are arbitrary but when you make the software, you just make choices. It is and increase of 30% and it is significant.

Please realise that if we just put 100% or 80%, this may be the end of successful war in the game and we must be careful.

We have some rules that we follow, and we check such attack results against these rules.

The problem of course is that all attacks and defense combinations are different and the rules will never fit all of these combinations.

As a result, some attack results will always be seen as unfair.

I am not sure this is a clear story.

Anyway, please do not aplogize for the questions and they are not dumb at all. We here think that you in fact understand many of the processes better than we do as you are more frequently confronted by the results of many of the functions we have put into the game.

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